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<atom:link href="http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><title><![CDATA[Comments on: What Mike Lazerow Got Wrong About Third-Party Facebook Apps]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments</link>
<language>en-us</language>
<ttl>120</ttl>
<description><![CDATA[Facebook is an ever-changing and evolving platform, but a lack of concrete knowledge regarding their ranking formulas further muddies the waters.]]></description>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Alex Bernstein]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92298</link>
<description><![CDATA[Didn&#039;t miss anything. The article was about third party publishing apps and their impact on engagement. 

That said, I&#039;m pretty sure your back of napkin ROI analysis for a high priced &quot;Swiss army knife social enterprise platform for the Fortune 1000&quot; doesn&#039;t hold water... if it did we wouldn&#039;t be seeing nearly as many big brand clients defecting as we have been lately...]]></description>
<pubDate>Fri, 16 Sep 2011 20:23 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Alex Bernstein</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Jay Davis]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92278</link>
<description><![CDATA[Alex- you&#039;re missing it big time. There is so much more to these platforms than potential engagement lift. Premium ROI analytics, enterprise level admin rights management and audit trail, community moderation automation, self-serve cost-efficient application creation, social commerce, etc. These platforms are actually quite inexpensive relative to their benefits and the opportunity costs of development staff (in-house or contractor). That said, premium platforms are certainly not intended for small business or individuals, but rather are tailor-made and cost-efficient for Fortune 1000s and the upper middle-market--often for an annual cost equal to less than 1-2 incremental FTEs.]]></description>
<pubDate>Fri, 16 Sep 2011 12:29 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Jay Davis</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Alex Bernstein]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92255</link>
<description><![CDATA[I find it amusing to hear two social software company executives playing ping pong about which high priced publishing platform can produce results roughly equal to what is already available for free on Facebook. 

Perhaps the quest for &quot;industry best practices&quot; ought to include the price of the publishing platforms in the equation?

I&#039;d love to see the ROI analysis of a 0.03% engagement lift.]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2011 19:11 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Alex Bernstein</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: reggie Bradford]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92250</link>
<description><![CDATA[Thanks for your comment: &quot;As for the branded App ID, our data did not take that into consideration due to the mass effort required to decipher all custom platforms vs 3rd Party APIs. We have seen other data (another company) that suggests custom platforms perform much closer to Facebook than the rest of 3rd Party APIs, however we have yet to confirm that. You may have a point here.&quot; I had seen that in your Q&amp;A of your study last week that it did not include branded app IDs, so we are definitely interested in any future reports you lead which may explore this more]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2011 16:35 EDT</pubDate>
<author>reggie Bradford</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: reggie Bradford]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92247</link>
<description><![CDATA[Sorry for the geek speak, you are right, lots of technical wonk here :) In a former life I was CMO of WebMD, and I take the point of getting to what it means for a marketer, so here goes, the difference in &quot;custom&quot; and &quot;3rd party API&quot;:the point here is do you want your brand posts app ID customized to say from &quot;Verizon Publisher&quot; w your logo and branding or aggregated w a generic app ID, such as &quot;Twitter&quot;, or just &quot;publisher&quot; or &quot;Vitrue publisher&quot;? If as Chad points out, &quot;we have seen other data that suggests custom platforms perform much closer to Facebook than the rest of the 3rd party APIs&quot;, ie better than 3rd party, then as a brand you want that branded real estate and impression to reflect your brands voice IMHO]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2011 16:28 EDT</pubDate>
<author>reggie Bradford</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: reggie Bradford]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92244</link>
<description><![CDATA[Thanks for everyone&#039;s interest and comments. Personally, sorry for the delay, while no excuse, I was traveling! We are all in violent agreement that a healthy, honest debate will continue pushing our industry forward, and enable rapid and fluid innovation.I think everyone benefits from the discussion as we all drill down to the most effective strategies and best practices.]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2011 16:04 EDT</pubDate>
<author>reggie Bradford</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: CARRI BUGBEE]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92203</link>
<description><![CDATA[What is the difference between a &quot;custom platform&quot; and a &quot;3rd-party API&quot;? You guys (Chad, Reggie, and Michael L.) have devolved into wonk speak here. Remember, the primary audience for Ad Age is marketers, not geeks. :-)]]></description>
<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2011 21:10 EDT</pubDate>
<author>CARRI BUGBEE</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Ruben Quinones]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92181</link>
<description><![CDATA[This is a topic that needs to be discussed and has barely been mentioned. Appreciate the dialogue.]]></description>
<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2011 15:37 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Ruben Quinones</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: michael lazerow]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92179</link>
<description><![CDATA[Hi Reggie, Thank you for this post. The more debate the better. My post was a reaction to the report that was being circulated last week about using third party apps to publish to Facebook and how they effect engagement. Since your post only focuses on one of the four points I addressed in my post, I take it that you agree with the rest of my post.

Our data clearly shows that right now third party apps are not as engaging. If you have data that shows otherwise, please share it. We released our data in hopes of making the entire industry more educated and transparent. I see references to &quot;data&quot; and &quot;evidence&quot; in your post, but no actual data or evidence. If you have data that shows I was wrong on one of the four points I made, then that&#039;s great for the industry. Lets move forward and please do share!

Buddy Media has the technical ability to offer both branded apps and single-tenant apps, like the ones you are advocating for. Our data points us to not recommend branded publishers to maximize engagement. So we don&#039;t recommend them. It&#039;s not a competitive issue for Buddy Media. We will do what makes sense for our clients. I didn&#039;t address the Top Posts vs Most Recent mainly b/c I didn&#039;t have the data that breaks down the different places that users can see posts (Top News, Most Recent, mobile, other apps like Hootsuite and Tweetdeck and mobile/tablet apps like Pulse and Flipboard). The data I presented was more of a blunt instrument to do a gut check to see if Buddy Media (and other multi tenant apps like Buddy Media, which I stated in the post) was seeing decreased engagement. The data speaks for itself.

Lastly we&#039;re talking about Facebook Edgerank. Edgerank visibility is based on engagement (and not impressions alone). That is the reason we used engagement rates (in addition to the fact that EdgeRank Checker used engagement as well). You want to boost engagement rates, because that is what influences Edgerank visibility (Check out this great EConsultancy post: http://econsultancy.com/us/blog/7885-edgerank-the-most-important-algorithm-you-ve-never-heard-of). We&#039;re in a world where engagement is king. Impressions are important but just a means to an end, with the end being engagement.

I don&#039;t think it&#039;s beneficial for either of us to get into a debate where you&#039;re calling out one company for the &quot;misuse of data&quot; in a post where you provide absolutely no data.

Nonetheless, I really do think we agree way more than we disagree.

Mike]]></description>
<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2011 15:04 EDT</pubDate>
<author>michael lazerow</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Chad Wittman]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92178</link>
<description><![CDATA[[As a disclaimer, I&#039;m the Founder of EdgeRank Checker] I think it&#039;s a stretch to claim that collapsing is of any value to the consumer. I do not have an official statistic on this one, but in discussing with many people the collapsing issue, most users agree that they tend to skip the entire block of collapsed content. I will agree, that most users use Top News as opposed to Most Recent (where this apparently is only happening). 

As for the branded App ID, our data did not take that into consideration due to the mass effort required to decipher all custom platforms vs 3rd Party APIs. We have seen other data (another company) that suggests custom platforms perform much closer to Facebook than the rest of 3rd Party APIs, however we have yet to confirm that. You may have a point here.

My last issue is that we did analyze impressions/fan (at time of post) at the request of our peers, when we released the data. We found very comparable results to our engagement/fan (at time of post). 

We are working on further detailing our study to help all platforms deal with the challenge.]]></description>
<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2011 14:37 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Chad Wittman</author>
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<title><![CDATA[By: Jay Davis]]></title>
<link>http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/mike-lazerow-wrong-party-facebook-apps/229771/#comments-92165</link>
<description><![CDATA[Spot on! Thank you Reggie.]]></description>
<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2011 13:26 EDT</pubDate>
<author>Jay Davis</author>
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